Training providers – are you about to lose your business?


Front Page Looking For… Training Service Providers Training providers – are you about to lose your business?

This topic contains 33 replies, has 9 voices, and was last updated by  Cobus Cato 8 months, 2 weeks ago.

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  • #68593

    sylvia hammond
    Keymaster

    Is your company registered with the Department of Higher Education and Training (DHET)? I have been told that some providers think there is a choice between QCTO and DHET – and anyway they are accredited by a SETA. This is a dangerous misunderstanding.

    The DHET is a government department in charge of with 3 quality councils, Umalusi for basic, CHE for higher education and the QCTO is the quality council for occupational qualifications and part qualifications.

    The DHET requires all providers of National Qualification Framework (NQF) registered qualifications to be registered with DHET. The DHET is a company registration
    The current SETA accreditation is to provide training on legacy qualifications. The SETA is mandated by the QCTO to provide this. All SETA accreditation will move to the QCTO. All legacy qualifications were re-registered on the 1st July 2018, and are in the process of being re-aligned to occupational qualifications. So, once the qualification that you are offering has been aligned to an occupational qualification, and is registered on the QCTO website, then you will require QCTO accreditation. The legacy qualifications will NOT continue.

    The QCTO will accredit you per occupational qualification – per site of delivery. The word here is Accreditation.

    The DHET is a Compulsory Registration – happening since March 2017 and the deadline is this month end. The consequences are seen on page 10 of the Registration Guideline.

    Previously the private Skills Development Providers (SDPs) could not be registered with the Department because the Skills Development Act (SDA), 1998 (Act No. 97 of 1998), as amended, in its current form does not provide for registration of SDPs only to be accredited in order to operate legally in South Africa.

    In order to fulfil the provision of Section 29(3) of the Constitution, a Joint Communiqué 1 of 2016: The Registration and Accreditation for Private Education Providers Offering Qualifications and Part-Qualifications on the Occupational Qualifications Sub-Framework was promulgated in October 2016. This Joint Communiqué calls on all SDPs to lodge their applications for registration as private colleges with the Department of Higher Education and Training.

    Do not confuse Accreditation and Registration.

    The QCTO application for accreditation is not complicated. There is one set standard instead of 21 SETAs with different rules.

    The DHET application for registration is compulsory, with required documents to ensure that the provider is compliant.

    What should be done first? The compulsory registration with DHET, the QCTO accreditation application does not have a deadline at the moment.

    So providers – whether you are accredited to offer one single legacy unit standard or a full legacy qualification, or a QCTO occupational qualification, it is compulsory for you to be registered with the DHET.

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  • #68598

    sylvia hammond
    Keymaster

    As all skills-u members will know I am passionately committed to the implementation of skills development. I believe it is one of the key pillars of redress.
    Therefore, I try to support the departments and institutions responsible for implementation.

    Please see attached the letter from DHET, which is apparently given to providers who have registered with DHET.
    Now I met Mr Firoz Patel and I have every respect for what he did – during his lifetime. To send out a document with his name on – after he is deceased – is highly unprofessional, and dishonours his legacy.

    But they are the providers who have registered. Surely the letter should be sent to every SETA accredited, and QCTO accredited provider? Has that been done?

    Do DHET have a distribution list compiled of all those SETA & QCTO accreditations – with those who have applied ticked off – so that DHET can keep reminding those who haven’t yet applied?

    Do you know who is the new Registrar of Private Colleges? Please let me know.

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  • #68601

    Bernard Botha
    Participant

    Sylvia,

    Thanks for the post. Very few private providers take this seriously – as you mention they argue that as they are accredited by a SETA they do not have to register with the DHET. The sad part is that the SETA’s seem to perpetuate this myth and do not make any effort to enlighten their members.

    Fully agree with your statement copied from above:

    All legacy qualifications were re-registered on the 1st July 2018, and are in the process of being re-aligned to occupational qualifications. So, once the qualification that you are offering has been aligned to an occupational qualification, and is registered on the QCTO website, then you will require QCTO accreditation. The legacy qualifications will NOT continue.
    However some SETA’s deny that as from 1 July 2018 all applications for accreditation and/or extension of scope should be directed via the QCTO and insist that all applications should be directed as in the past to the SETA concerned.

    What is clear is that the message is not reaching its intended target and while Skills Universe is excellent the target audience do not read it.

    Bernard Botha

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  • #68602

    Nigel Shipston
    Participant

    Hi Sylvia,
    Our biggest problem is that of communication. When Lynel and I met with the senior management earlier this year, they indicated that they have a Department that liaises with the SETA’s and that all communications would be done through this Department. However, in view of the range of “interpretations” coming from SETA’s to providers, it is clear that this process requires serious attention. The range of varying stories from providers clearly shows that the communication process has been a monstrous failure, as do the frightening number of providers who still need to register.
    We are waiting on a reply from the Minister and DHET regarding the deadline.

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  • #68603

    Ken Annandale
    Participant

    I have been following this and other related Short-Course training industry issues with curiosity.

    In a 2018 article concerning the gross and unnecessary over-regulation of First-Aid training providers [now read Short-Course industry] and the restrictive barriers being imposed on it I previously wrote:

    “In #SONA2018 President Cyril Ramaphosa repeatedly addressed the critical need for participation by SMMEs, including:
    1. Government is finalising a small business and innovation fund targeted at start-ups.
    2. Infrastructure investment is key to our efforts to grow the economy, create jobs, empower small businesses and provide services to our people.
    3. The establishment through the CEOs Initiative of a small business fund – which currently stands at R1.5 billion – is an outstanding example of the role that the private sector can play.
    4. Ultimately, the growth of our economy will be sustained by small businesses, as is the case in many countries.
    5. We will continue to invest in small business incubation.
    6. We will reduce the regulatory barriers for small businesses.
    7. We will work with our social partners to build a small business support ecosystem that assists, nourishes and promotes entrepreneurs.
    Source: http://www.thesouthafrican.com/sona2018-read-the-full-text-of-cyril-ramaphosas-address-here/.

    Furthermore, the Department of Trade and Industries underscores President Ramaphosa’s intentions with their Policy statement. DTI Policy – SMME Development: states that:
    “Government has prioritised entrepreneurship and the advancement of Small, Medium and Micro-sized Enterprises (SMMEs) as the catalyst to achieving economic growth and development. With the assistance of other government departments and institutions, the DTI takes the lead in implementing SMME-related policies, to ensure that adequate financial and non-financial assistance is provided to the sector, for its long-term prosperity and that of the country as a whole”. Source: http://www.thedti.gov.za/sme_development/sme_development.jsp.

    It stands to reason that existing and prospective SMMEs are not unduly impeded in the establishment and management of profitable First Aid training businesses, thereby creating further sustainable self-employment for entrepreneurs and employment of staff.”

    So where to from here?

    Accredited training providers who fail to register with DHET will be severely penalised [even possibly criminalised], while those who never bothered to apply for accreditation cannot be compelled to apply for DHET Registration, cannot be prosecuted and will have the right to continue as free-market operators with all the benefits due to them.
    Your thoughts?
    Ken Annandale
    ww.safetytrainingkits.com

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  • #68604

    malose mofomme
    Participant

    Good Morning, thank you for the information you have shared. My company is busy with the accreditation process with one of the SETA, are we suppose to register with DHET now or after we complete our process with SETA?

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    • #68605

      Nigel Shipston
      Participant

      Hi Malose,
      You get accreditation first, and once you have that you apply to DHET for Registration.

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  • #68625

    Cobus Cato
    Participant

    Sylvia, what you and all the other guys say, is very true however, there are still some providers who did not know about this as the communication is not always as good as we would like it to be. What are these providers now to do as the deadline is coming at quite a speed?

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  • #68626

    Andrea Mammes
    Participant

    Hi, Does this registration also apply to providers of skills programmes with only a few unit standards accredited?

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  • #68627

    Cobus Cato
    Participant

    I would also like to know that Andrea. Also where single unit standards are in question.

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  • #68628

    Andrea Mammes
    Participant

    Hi Cobus,
    I have since spoken to Nkhuliseni at the Dhet, and according to him áll training providers (TP’s) have to register.
    Taking into account the late hour for this registration, he confirmed that TP’s can submit the application with the most important documentation attached i.e. Tax clearance, Co reg forms, SETA Accreditation Report, and as much as possible of the other supporting documents that the TP has available. Provided of course that the outstanding documents are submitted ASAP.
    I trust this is correct as I base it on my discussion with Dhet.

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    • #68636

      Nigel Shipston
      Participant

      Hi Andrea and Cobus,
      Any provider who is accredited for any qualification, skills programme or even a single unit standard registered on the NQF must register with DHET. For those that receive accreditation in the future, the registration needs to done ASAP after accreditation is awarded. These requirements may seem obstructive, but when we look at the reality of uncontrolled and unethical providers in our sector against whom we have to “compete”, perhaps not so obstructive after all.

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  • #68630

    Cobus Cato
    Participant

    Thank you kindly Andrea, much appreciated

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  • #68631

    Cobus Cato
    Participant

    Another question I have is this. When a new provider is accredited for example, skills programs, how long does this provider have to register with DHET?

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  • #68632

    Ken Annandale
    Participant

    Bureaucrats and academics should be fast-tracking basic skills development, rather than throttling entrepreneurial growth with petty regulation.

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  • #68633

    Cobus Cato
    Participant

    Ken I cannot agree with you more on that, absolute truth

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  • #68634

    Ken Annandale
    Participant

    President Ramaphosa’s recent radical message https://youtu.be/YmG58iMBwRw needs to be clearly and unequivocally relayed to the bureaucrats at SETA, QCTO and DHET, with an incessant demand from the training industry for significant relaxation or total elimination of these arrogant, self-serving and discriminatory requirements. Entrepreneurs are not the enemy!

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    • This reply was modified 10 months, 1 week ago by  Ken Annandale.
  • #68642

    Cobus Cato
    Participant

    Nigel thanks for the clarity, although I get where Ken comes from I agree with you whole heartily. I have come across some of the providers you mention. They make life extremely difficult for the broader industry of Skills development as they come in at rock bottom prices and deliver way below standard programs. This puts the scare of death into potential clients not wanting anything to do with a training provider after that. The same issue manifests in the SDF environment

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    • #68646

      Nigel Shipston
      Participant

      Hi Cobus, our industry is fraught with fraud and unethical practices, and it is thanks to the inability of people to work independently in an ethical manner that we are all subject to controls. While nothing is perfect, the protection of Learners, employers and training providers is important to ensuring better quality training/educational interventions. Unfortunately most times employers and Learners have to first experience the uncontrolled providers before realising their mistake. This is a little frightening when the uncontrolled providers are dealing with high risk interventions in which lives are supposed to depend.

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  • #68643

    sylvia hammond
    Keymaster

    Hi to all Dr Mandlenkosi Buthelezi is in charge of this section. Alternative contacts are:
    Monica Motloi motloim@DHET.gov.za 012 3125012 or
    Gladys Maleatse maleatseg@DHET.gov.za 012 312 6017.

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  • #68645

    Des Squire
    Participant

    What is the situation with those who want to register a TVET college? What is the process to be followed?
    Do they register for full qualifications?
    Can they register for part qualifications as we know them i.e skills programmes?

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  • #68649

    Lynel Farrell
    Participant

    The above concerns and issues (over the past 18 months) have been submitted to the DHET, and we are awaiting feedback. To those who have taken the time to participate in our survey, thank you.

    We await the outcome.

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  • #68655

    Lynel Farrell
    Participant

    The Department of Higher Education and Training (DHET) have tweeted the following on social media this afternoon: 14 November 2018:

    HigherEduTrainingZA‏ @HigherEduGovZA 28m28 minutes ago

    The Department of Higher Education and Training (DHET) will host an awareness campaign against Bogus Colleges at Promenade Shopping Centre, Corner Samora Machel Street and Henshall Drive, Nelspruit, Mpumalanga Province, tomorrow, Thursday, at 08h00

    The campaign will target mainly, students and prospective student in Nelspruit and surrounding areas to verify whether the colleges they are either enrolled or intending to enroll with, are registered with the Department

    All private higher education institutions are governed by the Higher Education Act, 1997 and the Continuing Education and Training Colleges Act, 2006

    The purpose of this legislation, among others, is to ensure that institutions operate within the law, have the necessary resources, capacity and expertise to offer acceptable standards of higher education qualifications that are aligned to the National Qualifications Framework

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  • #68677

    sylvia hammond
    Keymaster

    The deadline to submit applications to DHET for company registration by 30 November 2018 has been lifted.

    Please don’t allow this to mean that you relax.

    It is still necessary for all providers, who become accredited to provide occupational qualifications, or part qualifications, or even single unit standards – that are registered on the NQF – to have their companies registered with the DHET.

    Many thanks are due to Nigel and Lynel who have been assisting providers with registration and pursuing the deadline issue.

    The document is also attached to their Concerned Providers discussion group – although we don’t usually do multiple posts, I have attached this document as is so important. We will load the DHET Communiqué 1 into the Downloads section.

    Please ensure that you have applied for registration.

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  • #68682

    Cobus Cato
    Participant

    Thank you Sylvia, this info will go a long way!!!

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  • #68746

    Ken Annandale
    Participant

    Hi all

    I curiously note Andrea’s comment “all TPs must register with DHET”.

    That’s not what I understand. Not ALL. It only applies to those who are already accredited. If it only applies to accredited, so how does it deal with the unaccredited?

    As for the industry being full of “fly-by-nights”. Really? Would anyone bother to define a so-called “fly-by-night”? Nigel?

    SA has a tried and tested prosecutorial mechanism that deals with fraud and criminal matters. Why another? Why a toothless one at that? Is it merely to justify more unproductive jobs and support practices by “Approval/Accreditation/Registration service providers”?

    So, why not just lay a criminal charge against the “fly-by-nights”?

    On a more serious note, how do SETA/QCTO/NQF/DHET/DoL directives advance job-creation? They dictatorially limit the reach of capable trainers and deny citizens access to basic skills and knowledge.

    And BTW, why are “short-course” providers treated like colleges and universities? Or do the regulators think we are one and the same?

    If I understand the rumours, SETA/QCTO/NQF/DHET/DoL Approved/Accredited/Registered TPs by-pass the stipulated requirements, and aid learners by short-cutting the NQF process when assisting them to complete the required PoE in the class? Isn’t this unethical?

    So much for the SETA/QCTO/NQF/DHET/DoL system 🙁

    This SETA/QCTO/NQF/DHET/DoL thinking has burdened ethical entrepreneurs with yet more bureaucratic regulation, adding to SA becoming one of the most irksome places on the planet for start-ups and SMMEs to operate in.

    {South Africa is ranked 82 among 190 economies in the ease of doing business, according to the latest World Bank annual rating}.

    So, simply, it’s time we heeded the President’s appeal for less regulation in our industry, not more. The debates should revolve around finding simple ways of maintaining quality in the training industry.

    Just saying ….
    Ken
    ww.safetytrainingkits.com

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    • #68750

      sylvia hammond
      Keymaster

      Ken,
      My understanding is that: all training/skills development providers, who are accredited to offer occupational qualifications, and part-qualifications (including single unit standards), that are registered on the NQF, are required to register their company with DHET.

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  • #68755

    Ken Annandale
    Participant

    Thanks for your kind response Sylvia.

    Sadly, therein lies the problem. “They” haven’t thought thing this through.

    To highlight this, the training industry have shown their contempt for these directives, as seen in the appalling stats and ignominious DHET backtracking.

    Simply put, this and other directives are directed at the wrong parties.

    It appears to be an expensive, futile, bumbling attempt to get rid of unethical “fly-by-night” operators, by focusing their attention on already obedient / compliant providers. Pourquoi?

    It fails to demand that unaccredited / unregistered / unapproved TPs [ethical or otherwise] comply in any way, manner or means. For them its business as usual.

    So we will have to wait and see. May 2019 is just around the corner and a reshuffle of parties and priorities is on the cards.

    Depending on the individuals viewpoint, it’s either highly entertaining or economically devastating.

    Regards

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    • #68758

      sylvia hammond
      Keymaster

      Thanks Ken,
      I hear your point of view.

      Personally, I have spent more decades in confrontational industrial relations than I have in skills development. So I am a negotiator. After every war the negotiators sit down to document the peace agreement.

      I have found the DHET very prepared to listen to a reasoned approach, and constructive suggestions.

      My opinion is that as a nation we are incredibly bad at implementation – despite a wonderful legal base, excellent policy statements, and detailed administrative procedures.

      So we should work together and focus on how we should get things done.

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  • #68759

    Ken Annandale
    Participant

    “It never ends, does it?”

    OUTA exposes a R162m SETA contract that appears to be structured to loot funds intended to help desperate job-seekers and young graduates.

    https://tinyurl.com/y8j9qnsa

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    • #68764

      sylvia hammond
      Keymaster

      Hi Ken,
      Thank you for that posting. I was not aware of it.

      It certainly is a disgrace – but does seem to justify exactly why the DHET want training provider companies to submit their company registration documents to verify their bona fides.

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  • #68765

    Lynel Farrell
    Participant

    I agree Sylvia. DHET is cleaning up the training provider space, which is long overdue, in order to get rid of the bogus training providers, many cases have been opened. With various cases in the SETA space, I would hope that the Auditor General cleans up a bit. Any compliance currently being implemented is for the sake of the learners. If your house is in order, then compliance won’t be a problem nor following the stipulations.

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  • #69088

    Cobus Cato
    Participant

    I need guidance guys, I have tried almost everything but to no avail. If I have only a qualification number, how do I find assessors for this qualification?

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  • #69089

    Cobus Cato
    Participant

    Ok, lets not forget, it ia a new year so, ALL THE BEST FOR 2019!!!!

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