5th Sep 2016 at 1:55 pm #26272
Having exhausted all other forms of normal communication with the ETDPSETA ETQA, I hope that this post will again come to the attention of Mr Sader, ETQA Manager. Two months ago, Pierre Wepener made a desperate call for attention, which led to an open meeting with all Providers on 5 July 2016.
I attended, I understood the challenges and resolved to be patient out of respect for the request to provide enough time to address all the challenges listed by numerous providers. And I appreciated the Nando’s lunch provided!
I was actually lucky to have a few SoR’s processed with only a few challenges around Datanet and absent staff within reasonable time thereafter. Patience and respect rewarded I thought. But then my misery started with the mistakes!
1. A learner awarded the Literacy unit standards at ABET 1 also has NQF 5 Conduct Outcomes Based Assessment on his SoR. This was partly my mistake, but not all the way – trying to have this corrected is impossible.
2. The renewed TP Accreditation certificate has incorrect unit standards listed and omitted accredited courses.
The second issue does not affect me at the moment, and I can be patient (although I would like to know that my report has not disappeared into that very dark pit of Inbox Ignored….)
The first issue however, directly impacts on the learner, the rest of the group holding back on receiving recognition for their accomplishments, the client company who thinks that I am just not interested to complete on the job started, the W&R Seta who has given up on trying to sign off on the project – and last but not least, my company not able to invoice for work done the last 6 months…..
- I have NOT cc’d everybody whose email address I know in the ETQA, only the person directly responsible and later on the manager….
- I have NOT tried to make 10 calls a day thereby flooding the switchboard…
- I have NOT been impatient in terms of time; I only reminded them every two weeks for the last 6 weeks….
- I have NOT received any recognition that my quest will be attended to…
But today, I tried to call. I am sorry I did, because now all hope is shattered that anything has changed since 5 July….you know the story…
Or have I missed some important announcement to Providers of the last flight to Mars?
6th Sep 2016 at 4:49 am #26301Nick Nevson Chipangura (BossNick)Participant
Thanks Zerelde. I attended the same forum where Mr Sader was promising a great change in his department. Nothing much changed. Im still sitting with same issues like before.Imraan has and is still helping a lot. My concern is how best can we fix these issues. Businesses are suffering a lot. Pierre thanks a lot. I also dont know why Mfowabo cant just dmit that he doesn’t want to do his job or ….. Extension of scope has taken the whole year for only 2 US. Come on Mahlangu just report on whats happening than to take my contact details ten time with no call made afterwards. I think its best to meet again with the CEO in the forum because im not so sure if SHE knows how affected we are as the training provider. ETDPSETA Helooooo onceagain.
6th Sep 2016 at 5:40 am #26300Hannes NelParticipant
6th Sep 2016 at 5:41 am #26299Bernadette perumalParticipant
6th Sep 2016 at 5:55 am #26298
Thank you for this discussion Zerelde, it is important to follow up on steps taken. The intervention that was held between providers and the ETDP Seta in July, was very important. Many issues were addressed. On a personal note, I found additional issues which goes back as far as 2006. For the past decade, I have been studying and opted do specific areas of learning. Problems and issues started with my results from UJ not reflecting on the ETDP Seta’s system. With this issue, I have been declined to do any RPL applications to further my studies, as the qualifications I completed and achieved means nothing until it reflects on the ETDP Seta SoR. I started investigating and asking questions. Apparently there are about 3000 students from UJ dating back many years, where their achievements are still not reflecting at the ETDP Seta – the problem apparently is that the ETDP Seta system and the UJ system is not compatible – so far back??? I believe that the ETDP Seta is sitting with their plate overfull. Drastic steps needs to be taken, more competent staff needs to be employed (whether full time, part time, temp) – I don’t think they have the capacity to address all the issues. I don’t want to sit in the shoes of the ETQA manager at the moment, as the problems and issues goes back many years. So do you address current issues, or do you go back to issues that started a decade ago? What are we to do now?
6th Sep 2016 at 6:31 am #26297Fanie AgenbachParticipant
6th Sep 2016 at 6:37 am #26296John SandysParticipant
Thanks Zerelde,I am positive that many will disagree with my comments following. I would like to share my recent positive experience with the ETDP SETA. We had a verification early in September and were fortunate enough to experience a vast improvement with the time to receive SoR’s. For the last year it took around three months, this last batch took three weeks. We must remember that Rome was not built in a day. I might be the fortunate one but when communicating with Mr Sader and many of the departments I normally receive feed back within 24 – 36 hours where in the past many of the emails were unanswered. I do believe that we should see even greater improvements in the near future. Thanks Mr Sader and your team for the improvements, trusting that we will see more these shortly.
6th Sep 2016 at 6:47 am #26295
Hi Nevson, did you contact the ETQA Manager directly with your issue? I can remember in the intervention it was communicated that if you have issues and it is not sorted out within 48 hours, then you email the ETQA Manager directly. The ETQA Manager is Mr Sader : email@example.com
6th Sep 2016 at 6:54 am #26294
Hi John, that is great news! I must say, that after the intervention I attended, there is some improvements, but your comment is the first to address that there are changes happening and a positive one. There is improvement on switchboard (I phoned a couple of times and calls are being answered, better than before – still room for improvement). With my issue, it was not resolved immediately or within 48 hours, I then requested help from Mr Sader, and he addressed it with the relevant staff member and copied me in with the instruction given to correct my decade old issue. Previous requests to “previous management” for assistance just never got anywhere. This has put my future on hold as a learner. I hope that my issue will be addressed and that I can comment on a positive outcome.
6th Sep 2016 at 6:59 am #26293
6th Sep 2016 at 7:08 am #26292John SandysParticipant
6th Sep 2016 at 7:13 am #26291
Hi John, only in the field of ODETDP, if the previous achievements are not reflecting on the ETDP Seta SOR, it means I have to re-do everything, which is not fair to me or any learner for that matter. I trust that this issue will be sorted this week, as I have waited many years for this to be corrected, and it looks like the only person thus far that is interested in getting previous mistakes corrected is Mr Sader. I take my hat off with the mess he is sitting with.
6th Sep 2016 at 9:16 am #26290
Thanks for this, John. May I say that in all the 10+ years I have been a provider with ETDPSETA, I have always approached them positively and could manage the system with satisfaction. (I always said that if you know the right question, you can maneuver to get the right answer…)
I manage to stay compliant because I respect the system, but the majority of my business (thankfully) does not rely on the Seta. I have just recently put 11 learners through with relatively little nudging and pushing. So, I still believe in them….but it is IMPOSSIBLE to get someone to take ownership where a problem arises. No business just works without troubleshooting, and the sooner one provides for efficient processing, the quicker one can go back to the root of the cause of issues and then sort that out. I am seriously concerned (and I gave them the benefit of the doubt at the meeting on 5 July) that root-causes can be seen and dealt with. It is my opinion that there is very little display of basic business principles, and I feel the victim of that at the moment. One can certainly not be spending all your time trying to interact with an organisation that has not yet published any intent of addressing the (very real) issues of providers at the meeting.
I recall that at the meeting there was much more emphasis from Seta side on the ‘bad school children’ than on those who have always followed the rules and played fair….. perhaps that is still their focus?
6th Sep 2016 at 9:45 am #26289
Positive Feedback!!! I received a call from Mahomed Sader at 11h30 and was handed to Imran to fix the issues in Datanet. I apologise that this is how I needed to get attention, but it worked……
Apparently the new management system is hoped to be implemented in the new year, which would alleviate a LOT of provider and staff challenges. Hope this helps to bite the bullet for others out there!
Thanks Imran for always being so positive in trouble-shooting mode, and thanks, Mahomed for your personal imput. This is commended. I wish you all the best with the rest!
6th Sep 2016 at 10:14 am #26288
Hi Zerelde, that is great news! It looks like the Seta is really trying to get issues sorted out as quick as possible. It will take time to get where they want to be. Positive feedback on any improvements will also motivate the staff at the Seta that they are on the right path.
7th Sep 2016 at 4:00 pm #26287Irene JamesParticipant
7th Sep 2016 at 4:13 pm #26286
I did have a good laugh now. I try to be neutral and patient which is not always that easy. I am digging deeper, but the more I dig, the deeper it gets. Should there be no outcome by the end of this week, the only way forward will be to liaise with the QCTO. At this moment in time, it is virtually impossible to blame one party and not the other. This issue have been going on since 2006 – so who do I back and where do I dig now – at the moment it looks like “Kimberley se gat” – but wait ……….. if you have a quicker solution, please share with me!! I am always open to suggestions/guidance/assistance/recommendations.
7th Sep 2016 at 5:36 pm #26285Irene JamesParticipant
I actually tried to delete my comment, because I thought it may be unfair, given that you have really tried to mediate this issue. But clearly my deletion did not work 🙁
But perhaps you and I need to have a friendly chat sometime ? I do respect you and thank you for what you are doing x
8th Sep 2016 at 5:01 am #26284
8th Sep 2016 at 6:43 am #26283
What is going on??? I am beyond words this morning. So, of I go and escalate my issue to the Head of Department Mr Letoka, with the uploads not concluded and not reflecting on the ETDP Seta SOR – a decade of issues, hey? I email the Head of the Department, Mr Letoka, and what do I get back????? Automatic reply that reads: “Please be informed that I will be out of the office until Tuesday, 03 February 2015” – are you for real? No wonder, there are issues and can not be sorted. Unacceptable!!!!
8th Sep 2016 at 8:41 am #26282
I urge you all to search on this site under NLRD and the articles posted in 2010 by both Sylvia and myself.
This problem is ongoing and no one wants to resolve it. Alternatively have a look at the article by Sylvia Hammond which I re-posted and also indicated I liked so as to bring it up again.
8th Sep 2016 at 10:04 am #26281
Hi Des, there is a problem. How do we address this? Do you take it up with the SETA? Do you take it up with the Provider? It is a fact that, the impact on non-uploads are affecting learners (I am one of them). It has a negative ripple effect on skills and qualifications achieved, as SAQA is not aware of this. With this said, the NLRD at this moment is not accurate. All statistics drawn regarding qualifications in South Africa is thus not the true reflection. Now, in order to take this up with the Authorities, factual information, numbers, names must be submitted – but where do we get this? The Setas won’t have all the information (if Providers do not upload results and request verification for approval, the Setas won’t know what is outstanding), if Providers have closed down in the past couple of years and have not uploaded results – what happens then? Is there a gap that exists from Verification that is approved, to the monitoring of the upload process until it is complete?
8th Sep 2016 at 10:29 am #26280
I too have been personally impacted despite having raised the issue in 2010. Nothing has happened.
I am currently in discussions with ETDP SETA, SAQA and QCTO in this regard and hope to have a resolution shortly. I have waited since June so another week of two will make no difference. My qualification was back in 2005 and is still not recorded.
I can advise further when I have been offered a solution.
In the meantime I am interested in making contact with providers who have been impacted or who have NLRD records and/or SOR’s outstanding. Please providers, have a look at the posts I referred to and lets do something to sort this out once and for all. Go to the link
8th Sep 2016 at 10:55 am #26279
Hi Des, I will wait to hear what your solution is, I need my results to reflect urgently. I am not prepared to re-do my qualifications which I have achieved – I have the Certificates which was issued by the University of Johannesburg, but they mean absolutely nothing if the results are not on the ETDP Seta SOR. Please keep me posted.
8th Sep 2016 at 2:20 pm #26278
8th Sep 2016 at 2:24 pm #26277
8th Sep 2016 at 2:58 pm #26276
Lynel, I stand to be corrected, but this is something to take up at SAQA level and with those working with the NLRD specifically. The line of communication should be through the service provider (UJ) to the relevant quality assurance body. If you dIdn’t get reaction from your provider, escalate to SAQA. I am sure there is a service for such queries. But then I don’t know all the facts in your quest.
I just need to comment that I am still concerned about exactly the same issues regarding the ETDPSETA as summarised in Pierre Wepener’s presentation at the 5 July meeting. I am also worried about their capacity to manage what seems to be an impossible backlog and/or implosion of functionality – even with the best of intentions to change. It seems as if they simply do not have the capacity, and we don’t see any intentions to build any of value….
Des, I share your concern from way back when, and I don’t know who will do something about it. Too many providers of quality learning has already left the industry. Unfortunately once the NQF is compromised, I am afraid it is not going to be an easy task to recover. The likes of Lynel’s frustrations can probably be found all over already. And I am not sure if posting complaints like this is doing ourselves any favour?
8th Sep 2016 at 4:30 pm #26275
Hi Zerelde, I have made contact with UJ, who in turn referred me to the ETDP Seta, whom have referred me back to UJ. UJ is accredited by the ETDP Seta. It is the responsibility of the provider to upload results. There seems to be a problem between the MIS/LMS of both that is not compatible. Although UJ issued their own certificates and have their own academic records which reflects the achievements, it is not the same as the SOR from the ETDP Seta. I do believe that you are correct to take this up with SAQA – they might be able to assist both UJ and the ETDP Seta. We might have hit the nail on the head here. I will most definitely give feedback of the outcome. This might help other learners, as we go through different issues and get solutions.
Your concern is shared with many regarding the ETDP Seta. Yes, there was an intervention between various Providers and the ETDP Seta – so many concerns were addressed and a lot of information was shared that day. You are spot on, once again. They do not have the capacity to deal with all the issues, this was addressed and acknowledged. The ETDP Seta needs help and assistance. There were Providers that offered assistance at no cost, but this was declined. In some way I do understand, but what is going to happen in the next couple of months – problems and issues won’t go away, it will just pile up.
Yes, you are correct, I am slightly frustrated, as this should not be an issue. But the reality is frightening. By posting our complaints/concerns/issues, there might be someone that went through the same ordeal, found a solution and had a positive outcome. This we share with one another, to help and guide each other. One issue could have an impact on thousands of learners.
I respect your opinion and thoughts, and I thank you for your comments. I believe that there will be a solution and a good outcome. Once this is done, I will share this with you. It might help a learner out there, that doesn’t have the resources we do!
8th Sep 2016 at 8:34 pm #26274
15th Sep 2016 at 8:58 am #26273
Dear Skills Universe Members, I believe that the following message should be shared with you. If you have studied at UJ in the past decade, I urge you to get your statement of results – make sure that your achievements are reflecting. I have been battling to get my qualifications loaded, and it seems like this is bigger than what I thought. I don’t believe that any qualifications have been uploaded from UJ to the ETDP Seta. This is a provider mistake clearly. The only individual that took action thus far was Mr Sader from the ETDP Seta. This time I have to give credit, where it is due. Thank you ETDP Seta for stepping up, it’s about time. Sorry that these uploads are historical and you are sitting with this massive problem. Maybe a panel of Monitoring and Evaluation Experts should red flag this issue?
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